Cracking The Whip On Your Financial Goals (with Lindsay Goldwert)

Hey stackers. Just a quick note before we kick
off another eight weeks of shows. Today’s show, no swearing. Actually, I think Lindsey does swear,
but as always we will beep that out. But this is a very adult
topic we talk about. It was very interesting to me how
Lindsey’s able to take this topic and draw some very, very straight forward life
lessons, but probably not a good episode. To have little kids in the car unless you
want to have some, maybe a little more adult conversations. All right. Enough of that, man. I’m excited about today’s show and
I’m excited about the next date weeks. Glad we’re back. Here we go. Here’s the song that we like to do for all
the younger set of people, the teenagers. What have you. This one it’s called vacations DOE. from Joe’s mom’s basement. At the stacking Benjamin show. I’m Joe’s Bob’s neighbor. Dugan. One fish, two fish. Big goals. Big wish. It’s dr Seuss’s birthday. So that’s why today you can learn anything
you want, including from a woman who wrote a book called bow down, Lindsay Goldberg. Lindsay shares, because she cares. The lessons she’s gathered from Dobbin
tricks is, wait, did I just say dominatrix is on this show? I guess that’s what it says. You’ll learn today from everything
she’ll say about getting goals and. Filling roles earlier in the show. We’ll talk about an acting pro. What can we learn from Rick Maraniss? Don’t be an ignoramus. Plus we’ll throw out the Haven lifeline
and for my trivia, still make time and now two guys who want to
start calling me mr Doug. It’s Joe and Oh judge, judge Jay I think he’s the other
side of that relationship. Bringing the whips. I’m fairly certain or getting whipped. He, he is definitely the one
who gets walked around here. Yes, yes, yes. Who pays for it? Hey everybody. Welcome to an exciting, another eight
weeks of the Stacie Benjamin show. I am Joe Selsey high average
Joe money on Twitter. And what a way to kick it off this week. Doug’s been naughty. Financial financial lessons learned from
dominatrixes and our friend from the spent podcast, Lindsey Goldberg, I’ve wanted
to meet Lindsey for the longest time or podcast is so funny. And now she has this new book, and it’s
funny because it seems salacious, but wait till you hear a lot of these lessons. Very, very click baity I guess way to
present some very straightforward stuff, which is classic. Lindsey can’t wait to get into it. Today’s show is brought to you by the
stacker, got some new pieces of the stacker that just came out. Long time readers of the
stacker will be super impressed. With the fact that we’ve got some new
ones, that there’ll be another email coming sometime soon that
there will be another email. Not only that, you can find out where
O G and I are traveling to next. We’ve got some traveling coming up. Lots of big, yeah, and we’ve got lots of
big news too that’s coming in the stacker. We’ll get it first head to. Stacie forward slash
stacker for more great show today, Lindsay Goldberg, kicking off the eight weeks
talking about lessons learned from dominatrixes about you and your money. But first we’ve got some headlines. Hello Dobbins, and now
it’s time for field. Favorite part of the show, I was
stacking Benjamin’s headlines. First deadline comes to us
from the BBC by way of MSN. Did you see this film favorite? Rick maranas? Is about to return to the screen. Remember Rick maranas,
honey, I shrunk the kids. They’re making a new one
and he’s going to be in it. That is all right. Yeah. Yeah. That’s all. No financial news. That’s it. No. Moving on. Next story, but wait,
there’s a big story here. Film favorite Rick maranas is to return to
our screens for a new sequel to the 1980s family comedy. Honey, I shrunk the kids actor also
started Ghostbusters Flintstones little shop horse Parenthood in the eighties
and early nineties but stepped away from onscreen roles in 1997. I never realized why
Rick Maraniss went away. I remember having this discussion, maybe
saw the headline about why he went away. Yeah, I do know this. His wife had died six years earlier and
he struggled to continue his film career after becoming a single parent and decided
to concentrate on raising his children, although he continued to do occasional
voiceovers for films such as Disney’s brother bear movies. His screen break turned
into a 23 year hiatus. I’m a single parent and I just found that
it was too difficult to manage raising my kids and doing the traveling
involved in making movies. He told USA today in 2005 so I took a
little bit of a break and a little bit of a break turned into a longer break, and
then I found that I really didn’t miss it five years ago. Marina’s declined to take
part in the all female reboot. Ghostbusters. It didn’t appeal to me. He told the Hollywood reporter at the
time, I still get the occasional query about a film or television role, and as
soon as one comes along, that piques my interest, I’ll probably do it. Fans are now excited to learn. Marinas will reprise his role as Wayne
Zelinsky for the new film currently titled shrunk Josh. God’s going gonna stars. Wayne’s son, who is an adult
now and aspiring scientist. He’s also due to appear in a forthcoming
Martin Scorsese directed Netflix documentary called an afternoon with SCTV. Of course, remember him from SCTV. Do you remember SCTV? Uh, yes, and I remember the name. I don’t remember. It was the Canadian version of. Saturday night live and it
started just some huge names. Catherine O’Hara, Eugene Levy, who of
course, they’re both on shit’s Creek. John candy was over there,
some fantastic actors. SCTV those were just, that
was some phenomenal comedy. But the lesson here, they’ll, Oh gee, this
is why people should fight for financial freedom because. Rick maranas was able to financially at
the point in his life when you needed to step back, he could do it. And I remember earlier in my career
thinking about moves that I had to make that were not moves that were great
longterm moves, but because of the fact that I had to worry about food on the
table tomorrow, I didn’t have the ability to make the longterm move. And I remember my goal being back in my
twenties the faster I can get away from this type of move. To move that actually build a sustainable
income stream, build a sustainable business so that I don’t have to
worry about the day to day the better. Cause imagine had Rick maranas
not been doing what he did. He couldn’t have taken that big hiatus,
which sounds like it was fantastic when he said he didn’t miss it, you know, five
years into the hiatus, he didn’t miss it. And if you’re not fortunate enough to be
able to have earned a lot of money, cause I’m sure you know relative to everybody
else at the time, I’m sure he was in the stratosphere of earning
zero zero zero one yeah. Which, which allowed him to
have the ability to save. I think we all . We all kind
of fantasize about that, right? Need to think about the, um, you know, the
mega millions or the Powerball gets up to a billion dollars or a couple of hundred
million and you’re like, ah, yeah, you know, after, after I blow through a
few million, then I’ll be able to save. And that mentality is the same. You know, when you’re making 50 grand. After I blow through this 50 grand, then
next year I can start saving or whatever. And so he obviously had the right
mentality because he didn’t say, well, after this movie’s over, you know,
then I’ll get the next movie. And then, yeah. But I think this is also a lesson in
thinking kind of down the line a little ways and kind of doing that. What if planning, you know, nobody likes
to think about the tragic events of. Of what could happen in one’s life. And you know, not all
of us are movie actors. None of you and I are. So I don’t know, maybe there’s one or two
listening and they have the ability to take, you know, large swaths of money and
put it away in the, well, if I ever want to quit, this is where I’m
going to take the money from. So how do regular people do that? Well, you just think through it
and you say, okay, if I were. Had to have to go through something
tragic, like a spouse passing away, and I wanted to stay home with my kids. What would that look like? What would I need in terms of income? And this is the purpose of having the
discussion of protection planning. The purpose of, in this
case, life insurance. And and your estate plan. But I like where you started
there around protection planning. Cause I feel like a lot of people start
with life insurance and the reason they start the discussion with insurance is
because they’re meeting with an insurance salesperson. And by the way, an insurance sales person
is always going to start the conversation smaller with insurance where the bigger
discussion around risk management I think is better because insurance
is one way to handle it. But it encompasses everything. What would I do. And I think the other part of it too, that
I heard you say from this story was he had lost his spouse and then was still
working and then changed his mind. Yeah. One of the things that I want
everybody to recognize is that. Hopefully you’ve never gone through that,
and hopefully you never have to go through that, but if you haven’t gone through it,
then you have no idea how you’re going to respond to it. And so you want to build in enough
flexibility, which I think is also part of your message of when it’s time to harvest. Make sure you save something
for the next couple of years. You know that whole story, but you
don’t know how you’re going to feel. If something crazy happens in your life,
you don’t know what you’re going to react or how you’re going to react. And then, you know, Rick’s case here, he
lost his spouse, went back to work and then said, no, I don’t want to. And so you want to build
in enough flexibility. So when you’re doing these calculations,
you’re having these discussions, which nothing is more fun than sitting across
the table from your spouse and saying, so. I was thinking about when you die,
how much money I’m going to need. You know, obviously it’s not fun to talk
about, but you do it while you’re quasi sane, you know? And not stressed out, but build in the
flexibility because you don’t know if you’re going to be able to work. Or want to work or want to stay home
and raise your kids for 25 years. You also bring up a good point here. Often, especially people are making
these decisions around open enrollment. They will decide how much insurance they
need themselves, and it really, really OJI isn’t about you. It’s about your spouse
because you’re dead. So your spouse really
should be, she’ll be fine. She can get a job. Yes. How many times did you hear that? Yeah. Not good. But I want to get back to the other one
because you know, I’m Friday, we’re going to have Dustin Haner join us. So the round table, cool guy. But getting away from somebody passing
away just without that tragic incident. You know, Dustin was working a full time
job and bought a rental property and bought another rental property. But another and he’s just putting
up these little bricks to the point. Then later on that he was able to do
whatever he wanted, and I think that we spend a lot of time you, you said earlier
we think about what if I win the lottery? Well, every time that Dustin bought
another rental property, he was insuring that he was going to have the
lottery happened to him later. Yeah, that’s right. I mean, if you take an objective, look at
your money and start looking at it from the perspective of this thing has a job,
you know, this 10 bucks, this a hundred dollars, this thousand dollars this bonus
has a job and some of it is a job of entertainment. Some of it is I need flowers in the
backyard cause I want it to look pretty and that’s perfectly fine. Or it’s a today show. Got to go see ms so-and-so
down at the dungeon aid. Or like Doug says, I
need a little me time. I’ve got my stacking Benjamins
paychecks time for a little meet time. Hello, miss. Uh, yes, exactly. I brought the whips. You bring the chains, but if you
treat every dollar as a specific. You know, every dollar has a specific job
and every dollar has a specific task and you think, okay, this money can turn
around and be, and it’s job can be to make more money. It seems so inconsequential. You know, I’m having this lesson with my
kids right now about money in the bank versus money in their investment account. We have a small stockpile account. We make our kids put half of their money,
whatever they get, they have to invest. They pick the stocks, you know, they
have whatever he American has right now. Tesla. Apple, Google, Netflix, you know,
Microsoft, Amazon, they have, you know, basically the S and P 500 they
have created an S and P 500 fund. I’m just getting, they haven’t, it’s
all technology stuff, but when they get dividends and my son rolls his
eyes and goes, dad, it’s two bucks. It’s $2 I’m like, yeah, it’s $2 this
quarter on that thousand dollar portfolio. I get it. It’s not a lot, but your bank account has
twice as much money in it and you got 11 cents. You know, you used that
dollar for a higher purpose. You and I were talking about business
ownership and looking at different businesses that are for sale. And we were chuckling about the one
that, uh, includes the four hotels for 92 million. You know, you and I could pull our money
together, start a little partnership. Imagine what kind of income
stream that creates though. I’ll bring the 92 well, do you think
this, like monopoly, do you think the dude started with four hotels, right? He started with that rental property. Yeah. You know, we look at this as a very
difficult thing in this financial independence and flexibility, and it can
never be me and all that sort of stuff. But if you look at it very objectively,
be the third party perspective, you know, you’re in it everyday, I know, but be the
third party perspective and say, what can I make this dollar do? What can I make this bonus do in order to
produce higher and better things for me? You know, you’ll find the opportunity
to have that flexibility down the line. Our second deadline comes to us
from the just start investing blog. High earner, not rich yet,
how to avoid becoming a Henry. Have you heard that term before? A Henry high earner? Yup. Rich yet. Yeah. Kevin is the author of this blog and
wrote, I recently heard a term pop up in a podcast ad hire and are not rich yet, or
Henry for short term, caught my attention as I was curious to learn more
about these mysterious Henry. So I did some research. I was interested or more about various
Henry situations and how to get out of them. It turns out living paycheck to paycheck
isn’t just a problem for the middle class and lower class in America can be a
problem for people who earn high incomes, which present them from accumulating
net worth and makes them feel broke. But the differences here is that a high
income earners have much more of an ability to get themselves out of that
situation, which is why, Oh, gee, you and I often start with find
ways to raise your income. Can help solve. That dovetails nicely into what
we were just talking about. Take your money, try to make more money. Doesn’t solve every problem, but it makes
it easier for you to do the thing that you need to do ultimately, which is
try to lock down your expenses. Five signs, you’re a Henry. A number one of course, is
that you make a lot of money. Number two though, you save
and invest little money. Second sign is they don’t save
or invest enough of their money. For me. He said that’d be defined as saving and
investing less than 10% of your income. Would you say saving less than
10% would define you as a Henry? If you make more than a hundred thousand. I’ve never heard it defined as people who
are not saving people working their way up. Well, I think he’s talking about Henry as
a lifestyle as , but if you’re somebody who’s making over a hundred thousand
dollars and you can’t save 10% of your income, clearly have a
problem, which is number three. You live a high cost lifestyle. Well, it just really depends on where you
live to, you know, $100,000 in Duluth, Minnesota goes a lot differently than
$100,000 in Austin, Texas does San Francisco no. We’re in San Francisco. You need a whole heck of a lot
of different in San Francisco. Yeah, but don’t you still think that at
$100,000 if you can’t save 10% of your money for the future,
you’re still doing it wrong. Well, this is the age old, like,
well, next year I’ll start my 401k. Once I get the off, then
I’ll start my report on K. and the reality is, is that we’ve all been
in this situation where we’ve made one 10th of the money that we make now, a lot
of charitable organizations, you know, we’ll talk about this. A church and that sort of thing. We’ll say, Hey, if you can’t give away 10%
when you make $100 a year or $100 a week, how are you going to give away 10%
when you make $1 million a year? You know? And when you look at that from the
perspective of somebody who’s making 1000 bucks a week, and you go, well, I make a
hundred thousand bucks a week, I will have all the money in the
world to be able to save Well, we all know about
how lifestyle creep works. So the answer is not
to go from zero to art. I gotta save 20% you know, I’ve never
saved anything, and now I’m going to max out my 401k. You know, you can’t do that. Start by saving 2% and then six months
from now, increase it to 3% and then six months from now increases to
4% or whatever you can do. Start with a low amount and slowly
increase it over time, waiting until tomorrow. Or saying, well, in five years from now,
when I get my such and such a thing, you know, and I. Get promoted again, then I’ll start saving
or whatever that’s falling into that rich dad, poor dad trap, you know, made
famous by Robert Kiyosaki years ago. This, this piece presents a five step,
fairly cookie cutter way to look at this. And it’s funny because when I first saw
this, the reason I like this piece is when I first saw this, I thought,
Oh, this is cookie cutter. But then I thought. Great advice usually is
kind of cookie cutter. You know, like when I hear these complex
plans just you need a charitable remainder trust. And then generally I think, and don’t get
me wrong, those can be good if you, if you’re looking at huge net worth numbers
and it can get complicated on it, but usually it’s very straight forward. Number one, set a budget and make a plan. Who knew that that might be number one? Number two, then save and invest. Number three, practice mindful
spending and saying no. Then number four, avoid
lifestyle inflation. Well, it turns out it
was a four step plan. Oh G. I thought it was five I’d like,
but there’s one more good one. No, there’s not. No, that’s it. It was so great. It was step five. Go back to number one and do it all again. Yes. Lather, rinse, repeat. I think that is lesson number one. He said success is going to be about
lather, rinse, repeat on some of those good habits in. And also back to our first
headline with Rick Maraniss. Number one, what are you doing to ensure
that you are working on your financial independence and as important. Is your risk management strategy in place. Lindsay Goldberg is somebody that
I’ve wanted to meet for a long time. She’s had a very funny podcast called
bent that is a not only very funny, it is. In some ways a lot like ours. She’s not trying to teach anything. Oh, gee. She’s talking to people like comedians
about their financial habits, and it ends up being very, very fun. Radio. Leslie’s worked with some of the biggest
names in personal finance as a journalist and just a great writer, but she’s out
with a new book called bow down, lessons learned from dominatrixes. Let’s learn some of those. Right now with Lindsey coming down the stairs to the
basement on the bow down book tour. It’s our new friend, Lindsey Goward. How are you? Hi. Thank you so much for having me. I’m really excited to be here. Well, it’s about time I got to
talk to you because my friends. Rich and Marcus from the
paychecks and balances show. They talked to you a couple of years ago. And even then during that conversation
I was like, I need to talk to Lindsey. And you know how things go. You’re like, yeah, we’re going to do that. We’re going to do that. So I’m glad that we finally
got you on the book too. Yeah, yeah. I met them at a fin con
in 2000 and something. Um, I think we met a line in and out
burger and we struck up a friendship. I was emceeing at that. A fin con. I was the MC of that. That one. Yeah. That was fun. Small world. So we got close. We almost made it. Yes. Yes. I want to ask you, you’re
working as a financial writer. And at the same time you
start up doing standup comedy. How did those two things go together? It’s very funny. I always dreamed of doing standup
comedy was my dream as a child. I was a very strange child. I decided that I wanted to do it. At the same time that I had, I was sort
of figuring out what to do with my career. I had been a journalist for a long time,
um, and I still am, but I was working in the newsroom and I had just decided at
one point that I just needed to change. Changed my life and follow a dream. So I started doing standup at the
same time I was working at Capitol. I just ended up getting a job at the
app capital with the queue the way it’s supposed to be, capital in the queue. Yeah. I still think the world of those guys. And um, I just had this idea. I was in the shower one day
as all good ideas happen. And I said, um, it, it’d be really great
to do a funny podcast about money to talk to comedians about their money mistakes. So I just started to
find ways to bring in. This interest I have in money. I’m not a financial expert per se. I’m not a CFP, but I do know, I do
understand a lot of it and I do understand a lot of the behavioral aspects of
things, and I am very interested. I’m an enthusiast, so suddenly I just
started thinking of ways to bring my comedy background with
my interest in money. I wouldn’t, the idea that every story is a
money story, whether it’s a family dating, everything is a money story. If you find the right hook. It’s interesting because as. I was prepping for today’s discussion. and it was so funny because you get
the same negative review that we get. Not enough nuggets, Lindsey, you’re not
telling people the answers the world. What the hell is wrong with you? I know. I hear that. And it’s funny, you know, at the
time I know I didn’t feel like I. Could give any kind of advice. And then, um, and I felt
they was irresponsible. And then when I went to, after
that, I went to go work for stash. I became another personal finance app. I went, I became their editorial director
and I became a lot more knowledgeable about saving and investing. But I, I still don’t want to give advice. I think I can give an encouragement and
I can give empathy, but I’d rather have someone else come on and give the advice. I don’t know. But it is funny. People do want a lot from their podcasts. But there’s some people that they feel
comfortable telling people what to do. And I’m more of a listener
and I’m more of an empathizer. And then if someone has questions, get
someone else in the room to answer that. So yeah, I like lobby. Well, and I like what you say at the
beginning of the book, which is that the stories to you and to me too,
are much more interesting anyway. And I frankly think that we learn from a
real story much more than in you say this, I’m quoting you much more than a Ted talk. Yeah. I just prefer, I just might taste, I’d
rather hear a work story or a salary story or a health insurance story, or like a
labor dispute story from somebody who is, was in it from an interesting perspective. You know, the book,
um, you know, bow down. I interviewed dominatrixes from all over
the country about how to get what you want and it, the book ended up being. Kind of sexy. I initially sold the idea is kind of a
business book, you know, with this idea of who are the most assertive
women I can think of. You know, it was kind of, but in the end
it ended up becoming a little more, you know, a little more
personal and emotional. Cause I had a lot of stuff personally
that I wanted to figure out how to say I wanted. But, um, in the end, I’d
just rather hear him. A financial issue from a comedian or
hear about trusting your intuition from a dominatrix I, you know, I just, I
think entrepreneurial stories are more interesting when they’re from
people who have a better story. I want to be, that’s the
daily news journalist in me. Well, no, and me too. When I first started off, I’m a former
financial planner and I thought that I was going to give great advice on the internet
and going back, it was so damn boring. It was so incredibly boring. And the more that people, you talk to real
people about stuff, and I’m sure you get pitched for spent all the time, and I get
pitched by all these experts and I’m like, yeah, I don’t, I don’t, yeah, we’ll have
some experts on, but I’d much rather talk to, I’d rather talk to you about comedians
and about what you find interesting about them or dominatrix is. Because I’m not an expert. I have my own idea of what financial
literacy should also include. I think that it’s important to know
about IRAs and 401ks and all that. It is important, but that’s
not what I’m here to say. I’m here to, from a power perspective,
you know, you people, you have to feel confident enough to ask questions. You have to know that it’s not your fault
for not understanding the fine print, but you have to ask what the fine print is. You should be able to just have a
basic understanding of what you see. In in, in the news about what’s happening
cause you should know what to be mad about. So I think there’s different kinds of
financial literacy that can make you give you power back. And my theory is that if you can know when
to ask questions, I get, if you can read the fine print and you can tell when
you’re being sold to and being scammed, you’re already 50% ahead of the pack. So to me, that’s a part of financial
literacy that I don’t think people think as as quite as important. So that’s something that
everyone can relate to. Not everybody has money for
it to a 401k, but everybody. Can access that information at a time. People like, Hey, like
why are you hard selling? Hey, I want to dive into the book here in
a second, but before I do that, I don’t know about your money story. Are you somebody that’s
generally awesome with money? Are you more like me where you’re a
financial disaster and had to create a bunch of like walls for yourself. Yeah, I definitely,
I’m an emotional eater. I’m much better being an emotional is, I
was a bit of an emotional spender and I’m getting better at that. I have a lot of issues
with money and guilt. You know, my dad raised me to be
extremely responsible with money. My dad is, has is a. You know, very self-talk guy. I felt, because I was a creative person,
that I couldn’t be good with money. I couldn’t, uh, I was
never terrible with money. I never, you know, I wasn’t, I
didn’t go out and buy a Ferrari. I wasn’t like a shopaholic or
anything, but I, I saved my taxes. So last minute, and I just sort of. I wasn’t great about it. I wasn’t great at like setting
money aside for goals or budgeting. I just sort of started, I dealt with my
money in a very linear fashion like I’ll deal with as it happens. I wasn’t very strategic and I
think that it’s a challenge. It’s it’s discipline. And as somebody who is becoming more
disciplined as they get older, I have a lot of empathy for people. You know, it’s not really fun. And if you think you’re a creative person
like myself, you feel like you’re not trained to do it. You’re not a math. Rain on a business brain. So I also try to talk to other liberal
arts and artsy people to be like, it’s okay. You know, like you don’t
have to be a genius to do it. You just have to believe in yourself
enough to think that you deserve to take a little bit of better care of your
money and not just feel like effort. Rob, we’re all going down. We have a lot of people
feel, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I’ve met those people
that we’ve interviewed. So you and I both have interviewed some
of those people when, uh, there’s a whole different deal. But I don’t get why so many creative
people, and this is maybe the next time we have you on, but so many creative people
think that they’re powerless around money. Because I personally, frankly think that
this space where people like, I don’t know if you know Austin Kleon but
to steal like an artist guy. Uh, if you’re familiar with that book,
like, you know, this, this place where business meets creativity is
such a, such a phenomenal place. And I think that creative people are
so, they’re so used to thinking, this is horrible term. I’m going to throw up in my mouth. And I say it. They’re used to thinking out of the
box that there’s a lot of financials. Oh my God, that was horrible. I hate that, but perfect. Go back. Sorry. I’ve got nice work that, I dunno. Maybe it’s between our ears, Lindsey. It’s interesting. I think things are changing a little bit. I think that. The creative work out there that’s
independent from commerce is harder and harder to come by. You know? I know some people are happy, you know,
there’s advertising and things like that, but in my day as a, you know, a child of
the nineties you know, there was a lot of like, you’re a sellout,
you’re this, you’re that. People cared more about
that sort of thing. But then again, people are just feel
very, at the much at the mercy of. They just don’t have any faith that
they’ll ever get to be paid fairly. They just have, they don’t have a lot of
trust and companies who are going to pay them. So I feel like they, they feel
like it doesn’t really matter. Also, people do not have the
confidence to ask for more. Yeah, totally true. And I am the same person. I really identify with people who
listen to me and her talk to me. Um, it’s taken me a lot to be able to say,
you know, the people will say, you know, I’ll pay you $200 for an 800 word article. And I say, can we make that three 50. And I used to feel like people would
think I was a jerk or pick I was greedy. And then if they just say, Oh, we can’t
do it, then I’d have to make a decision. But you can say it in a way that’s very
kind and honest and direct and gracious. There’s a way to ask for what you want
in a way that feels natural to you. I am nice. I am gracious, but I also think that’s
absurd to be paid $200 for a 600 word article that’s going to have interviews
in it and even getting paid $350 to me is still. Ludicrous, but if it’s worth it to me, and
if they say no, then you sort of know what you stand with them. You know what kind of
an opportunity it is. But I have become brave in my
later life and most people aren’t. And they don’t ask for they, they, they’re
all, you’re just afraid that people are gonna roll their eyes at them. And if police rolls their eyes at you,
then it’s probably, that place probably isn’t in great condition and it’s probably
not as healthy of a place to work for anyway. So people need to have a little
more faith in their skills. Those are themes by the way, that you just
talked about that resonate over and over in bow down. So let’s dive in. I’m going to quote you from
the introduction of the book. I’m going to read to you
from, from your book. You wrote this. You said all of this got me thinking about
why I’d always struggled to get what I want in the macro sense. Yes, I wanted to get a
handle on my eating habits. Yes. I wanted to have a career
that I could be proud of. Yes. I wanted to feel powerful
about my finances. Have a great sex filled
marriage and walk and talk with. Confidence. I began to realize that there was no
product or treasure map that would offer me easy solutions to any of the above. What I was seeking was a philosophy to
live by, and as I’m reading this is I’m starting to get into bow down. Lindsey, part of me thought, I’m
like, this is a book as much for you. I felt like you started out thinking, Oh,
I’m going to learn these business lessons, but it sounds like no, you’re
even in the introduction. You’re like, no, this is
kind of what I need for me. 100% and the introduction
came later in the book. I actually wrote the introduction later
as I was meeting with these women. I thought they were going
to have all these answers. I sort of step-by-step answers and the
book is laid out in lessons, but they didn’t really have answers because they
didn’t, they’re still figuring these out for themselves, and their answers
were very personal and they. Gave feelings about their, their
philosophy on life and what they’ve learned. And I realized I was sort of going
through something in my life. I was, I was, I was about to turn 40 and
I was doing a big risk, leaving my job to write a book. I again, was mid marriage, you know, my
husband and I had been together for a long, very long time and we were just
trying to figure out what was, you know, like it’s, I had a lot of questions
I wanted to enter my face. Two, hopefully out of four were at least
three, you know, I wanted to enter feeling confident, you know? And I ended up asking them questions that
were purely about myself, and then hope that they would be relatable to
other women who were around my age. You know, whatever that means. But a lot of older, when my mom read it
and she found it helpful to, you know, so it became very personal in a way that I
didn’t think it was going to be personal for sure. So it’s the beginning. As a standup comedian,
I’m thinking about you. I don’t know. You’re on a park bench or something or
having wine with friends and you’re like, I’ve got this crazy idea. I’m going to talk to dominatrixes
and it’s going to be flippant. Hilarious. I mean, that was, that was me knowing a
little bit about you, but that’s just me internalizing what I think about you
telling me about the original Genesis of the book. So I had some interest from an agent about
writing a personal finance book, sort of based on spent, and I couldn’t find
something that would work on my idea that I have for spend, which I would love to
do one day is to do more of a studs Terkel type. Um, people like a kind of a, how I do it
from an artist perspectives and what I learned and what their lives are like. My agent was like, I, that
might be kind of hard to sell. So one day I want to do that,
hopefully, maybe next year. I hope so. I don’t know. It just came to me one day. I just, it was like a shtick, you know? I was like, well, what would be the most
assertive woman I can think of them? And I have a dark side. I’m not afraid. You know, I’m, I was interested
in seeing what it would be like. I have, um, you know, reporter, I’m not
afraid to wander into a dungeon or to walk into a club and do stand up. I mean, I, you know, in the end, you just
have to accept that you’re going to bomb. When you do comedy, you’re
going to bomb when you. Go up to strangers at the dungeon and no
one wants to talk to you, which happens a lot. Um, I don’t want to make this too, too
dirty for you, but like I, I had a lot of very awkward situations, but, uh, but in
the end, you know, I was very, I was lucky that I was, I’m not afraid
to cold call people. I wasn’t afraid to just like
put myself out there when I. Spoke to the women I was. It was very important to me to be very
gracious to approach them with as much respect as possible. These women in sex workers in general
are not treated very respectfully by the media. They often feel very exploited and I
really wanted them to know that I wasn’t there for a gotcha story. I wasn’t looking for any. Creepy store. I wasn’t looking for that. So I just really wanted to put their
philosophy and I want to dispel some myths about what they do. And they reluctantly were, you know, were
very gracious and giving and generous with me. So I feel very, very blessed. That leads to a couple of things to
the reaction to the book you wrote is different when you talk to men about
the book and women about the book. Talk about that for a second,
cause I found that kind of funny. Well, it was very funny in the beginning
when I, you know, I worked at a startup. You know, the younger
guys are pretty cool. You know, people make fun of millennials
and how awful are, I think the millennials are pretty great. And so a lot of the guys I told, um, the
older guys were very freaked out, you know, they were like, Oh, well. Like, my boss couldn’t believe I
was leaving a job to do something. Yeah. So crazy. But um, it’s awkward, you know, for a
woman to big, I’m writing a book about domination cause there’s maybe it could
be immediately very emasculating to them, which is silly. But my response to the book since then, I
mean, I don’t know, a lot of men have said they bought the book. They haven’t given me that
much feedback from it. But. My husband said that he’s taken
some negotiation advice from it. You know, and some guys got in touch and
they said something that they learned a little bit from it, but
women got it right away. They all want to be able to say
what they want, be more assertive. They don’t want to sound like a bitch
for asking what they want at work. They don’t want to be nice all the time. They don’t want to say yes to
things when they really mean no. And this is women from all walks of life. You know, whether you’re like on the C
suite or whether you know working, you know your cashier, we’re all. We all want to sound better. We all want to sound smarter. We all don’t want to be stepped on. So this is a universal thing. And I found a lot of the books for
women and encouragement were all very. They seemed a little bit elitist, you
know, it was all very much for people of a certain age and class and money thing
and it’s like, no, this is for everybody. I want to go through some of the lessons
just in the first couple chapters and one you just referred to, which is saying, I
want you found that dominate tricks is, are very clear about what they want and
the people that they’re working with. Are also have to be very clear, like
this is a, this is a relationship and an negotiation. Tell me about that. Absolutely. So it’s a complicated question because
if you are seeking the services of a dominatrix now you want to be in a city,
you want to be told what to do, you know? That’s the thing. So the person who wants to
be taken out of control. The stereotype of a person who sees a Dom
is sort of, is a person who is in control in their daily life. There’s somebody who is a boss, or there’s
somebody who’s like, who they want someone to be in charge. Okay. When you come to see someone,
these women are expensive to see. You know, they want someone
to just be very clear. It’s like, you’re going to sit over there. This is what you’re going to do. This is what we’re going to do. And it’s a relief to have
somebody just like, you know. And then anything, it got
me thinking a lot about. How clear language makes
life easy for everybody. If you say, this is what we’re going to
do, this is what I want, this is what I don’t want. Then the other person doesn’t have to
think too much about, well, what are they? What are they really trying to say? What does her body language mean? I don’t, you know, I have a rule like
don’t try to read my mind and I won’t try to read yours. And I think about all the time, I would
say things just to be nice, you know? Instead of saying, I really don’t want to
go to this restaurant, I’d say, well, we could go there, but what I really meant
to say was, I don’t want to go there. And what was, why was I being a kid? And in the end, I would, not only was I
ruining my own night, the other person didn’t even have the chance. The other person might’ve been
like, okay, let’s go someplace else. I was like, I think about all the
times I did things to be polite. Yeah. But you talk about the high stakes, I
mean, not to cut you off, but I’m going to anyway. But the higher stakes things like in work
negotiations, like we do so many things to be polite and you’ve seen the studies
as much as anybody, Lindsay, that women especially don’t want to be
characterized, want to get along, right? Be a team player. And often to your point. If they are a little bit, um, uh,
hard-edged in a workplace, they’re seen as the bitch in the office and know it’s 100%
true and women have to really tow that line. And it’s frustrating cause we just want to
be able to come in and say what we want. Like this is the plan,
this is what we’re doing. And you do have to do it with a
smile, which is really annoying. And I don’t have an answer to
how to fix that in the workplace. How you should go in and. And not have to smile, but if you do have
to, if that’s then you, you, you, then you double need to ask for what you want. Then you have to go in and
say and come in with data. Don’t come in with your feelings. It’s very hard to say, this is what
I’ve done in the last six months. This is the job title I had. This is what I, this is how
much I’ve moved the needle. and I believe I deserve this raise and
just leave it there and don’t qualify it with your fee and don’t take your eighth
grade feelings of inadequacy in there with you. Just keep them aside and just
let the data do the talking. But the smiling thing is difficult. A friend of mine at work at my old job
was told to smile and she was so upset because, not because she was, because only
she was told to smile about stuff that was upsetting to her team. And it blows. It’s even frustrating to hear. But you, you say there’s an art to being
direct while still being courteous. Yes, I believe kind, honest, and direct. That is my ethos for life is don’t qualify
what you’re saying and you have to be true to yourself. I am nice. I am gracious. So that’s just who I am. But if you’re kind,
everyone appreciates that. If you’re honest, you will. You will be grateful to yourself because
you said what you really meant and the other person knows that
you’re not sugarcoating it. They might’ve like what you have to say,
but that’s sort of on them, you know, and direct don’t beat around the Bush. This was something I learned at my
last job, which I had a great COO. She taught me a lot. And it is better to be direct
with somebody even if it hurts. But if you, if you are kind about it,
don’t do like a sandwich, which is like a compliment. The, um. The feedback and then a compliment. We talked to, we talked to Ashley Goodall,
who was just published in the Harvard business review last summer
and has a fantastic book. He and Marcus Buckingham about
workplace and workplace culture. He called it the same exact thing. Same exact thing. Yeah. Point and it’s confusing, but I think
in the delivery of it, you do, you can cushion the delivery without pouting it. You can say like, listen, like this might
be hard to hear, but blah, blah, blah. But I have to tell you. And then if the person gets upset, just
like, let them be upset, but by saying, but you’re so great at all these others. It’s just, then there’s like, what
did I do well or didn’t I do well? And you can say like, here’s what to do. And you know, just there’s a, if there’s
an art to it and people are so afraid of offending people, people are
very afraid of insulting people. It is not easy. I don’t have the answer to do it, but you
to be true to yourself and to get across what you want to say. You have to just stand strong, you know? And just say like, this is who I am. And especially if you’re a boss, I think
people are a little stronger than you think. And I think if you’re a great communicator
and you have a whole policy of being, having an open door, and. You know, making direct feedback part
of who you are from the beginning. I think we crave it. I mean, to me, I crave direct people. I crave people telling me what
they really think about me. I mean, don’t get me wrong. I want you to be on my team and I want to
know that it comes from a place of love, not from, you know, somebody
trying to put me down. But man, if I know you’re
on my team, I remember. I used to buy really cheap shoes. And uh, I remember a mentor of mine
telling me he’s, he’s like, you’re a financial planner and
you wear plastic shoes. Like, don’t get me wrong. It’s cool that you want to save money,
but people look immediately at your shoes. And they’re like, uh, why
didn’t we send you to see? You could always tell. You know, but that is good
advice and it’s concrete advice. It’s something that you can fix. It’s not just like a personality
flaw, which is hard to fix overnight. I mean, the help I had on my book by my
friends who were editors, they gave me really direct feedback and
they said, this is a mess. This is a mess. You need to fix this, this, and this. But I also asked for feedback. I said, this is what I need help with. I asked for very specific help
and they gave it back to me. I didn’t just say, tell me what you think. And that comes directly, I think too. I mean, reading bow down. I mean the dominatrix is need feedback
from the people they’re working with because you know, there’s sexual stuff
going on here, but it’s also a big time psychology and there is
a significant downside. These women could
totally mess somebody up. Psychology if they go too far or not far
enough, or, I mean, it’s got to be . The spot on thing. Absolutely. And everything has to be
negotiated beforehand. And sometimes things can get a little far. That’s why you have safe words. But, um, I wanted the domes, writes
everything down on a whiteboard. Like, this is what we’re going to do. I mean, it sounds very on
a Roddick, but she did. It’s, it’s so important. Everyone. Safety, emotional, safety,
everyone’s physical safety. And if you’re a professional, you want to
do, no matter what you do, you want to do a good job. And you want the, you want to have a
return customer them to come back, tell their friends, you know. So, um, absolutely. And I found that I. Thought about that idea. But if you say what you want up front and
you say what you agree on, and I thought about when you start a job and you agree
on a job description, and then some, the throwing all this new stuff that you have,
that’s pretty unfair, but you just sort of go with it, you know? And people can be very pushy and you have
to push back to, if you agree from a Dom perspective, if you agree to do one
thing and they’ll go, how about this? How about that? But I’m already paying you so much. You know? How do you step back and say, actually
like I’m an . You know, they’re kind of almost performance artists really. It’s like actually know what I’m doing
and, uh, that’s not what you get for this amount of money. And, and, and in the end, like, you don’t
want to give everybody what they want right away. You know, you wanna
want them to come back. Yes, of course. It’s just, it’s like everything else. It’s like leave them wanting more,
you know, it’s, it’s showbiz. So, yeah, I forgot the thread. No, that’s the part of the interview
where I always just go to the, yeah. Yeah. Like I’m done. Um, I mean, I want to talk about this for
four hours, but I get just a couple more questions. A lot of this as I’m reading, you know,
one big problem that I dunno, maybe you’ve seen in your marriage I’ve had in mind
a lot of times couples don’t communicate really well and a lot of this, a lot of
what I was reading about down is about effective communication, about being real
with each other, about what you want for yourself and for your money. Yes. There wasn’t as much money,
direct money stuff in the book. If I had more time to write it, I probably
would have written a whole chapter about money. But, um, maybe that’s the next thing. No, but it really is about power. And I think that translates. It isn’t, I mean, your
readers, Lindsey, are smart. I mean, as I’m walking through this, I
totally saw the, the synapse in my brain connect. That’s awesome. The communication aspect is
the most important thing. Um, to be able to say what you want and to
be able to tell your partner what you want and what’s important to you
is the most important thing. I, this book was a big lesson for me in
my own marriage, but getting too specific, you know, I did with my husband since
we’re 25, you know, and we had grown and we had changed and our
careers had changed. And in the end, even though we were best
friends, I was struggling to tell him certain things. I was afraid of what he would say. I was afraid it would. I w it was just a lot of fear and you’d
think about, what am I so afraid if I’m, I’m not afraid to get up on stage and like
bomb in front of like a bunch of drunks, but I am afraid to tell, to tell my
husband that I, I don’t know if I want to go back to work full time. I don’t know what kind of, you know, if I
wanted, you know, we didn’t decide not to have kids. I had a very big effect on our marriage,
you know, like what kind of life do you want to have if you don’t have children? And I didn’t know how to
begin those conversations. And we were from different backgrounds. I’m Jewish, I’m a little more yacky. He’s a little more. Reserved and we both needed some help to
just say like, no matter what you say, no one’s going to walk out. No one’s going to leave, but
it’s easier said than done. I have a lot of empathy for people who
just would rather, it’s very easy to just let it go and just let it go forever. I just have a lot of empathy and
especially when it comes to money and secrets, anything with like a
secret, I have a lie, I just get it. You know? Yeah. It’s not easy to confess the MSG to
confess things that you’ve done that you’re ashamed of. Like, Oh my God, like it’s so hard. And to most people, this whole
relationship is a secret. You know, this guy’s not going to go to
work the next day and go, Hey, guess what I did last night. You know? Totally. And that’s complicated too, you know? And it’s very interesting. So that’s the people, a lot of men do see
these women as men, see sex workers in secret, you know? And that’s something that I’m. They have to figure out if they, this
is just some sort of diversion for them. Or if they are sort of blocking some
aspect of their lives that they can share with their spouse. Some people do share with their spouse and
their spouse says, that’s not my thing. You know, like there’s, you can’t, you’re
not always going to get what you want when you’re honest with your spouse. You know, you might, it’s, some of them
might be like, Oh, you know, or some of them might be like this not my thing. Or some people might want to, I met some
couples in their sixties who when I was writing this book and they were like,
ah, you know, we figured, you know. Five sure. Let’s give it a try. And I thought that was the most
romantic thing I ever heard. I was like, you guys were like goals. You know that you care enough about each
other to try something really out there together. So secrets are hard to, you know, it’s
like, some people like to keep secrets and some secrets are damaging. Some secrets are just, everyone’s
allowed to have a private life. But it’s something that when you think
about spending a lot of money that your spouse doesn’t know about, you do have
to think to yourself, well, what is that about? And what are you really asking for? You know. And there’s no answer. I don’t have the answer for you. You’ve got to figure
that out for yourself. I want to talk about some of the words in
the book, and we’re not going to get to this, but I want to tell everybody some of
the words that keep coming back over that you keep going over and over,
which are the idea of consent. You even kind of dumb this down a
little bit and talk about hugging. I am not naturally a hugger. You talk about some people who are overly
huggy and there’s this line, this idea of consent. I found fascinating negotiation. Boundaries, safe words, respect, uh,
just, just some powerful stuff here. Tell me though, I want to end on this, if
you don’t mind, Lindsey, tell me about one or two of these women
that really affected you. Like you went in, I’m sure, to some of
these interviews, thinking one thing and then came out with a
whole different feeling. Can you tell us about, uh,
one of the characters or two. Absolutely. Well, so one of the women I met at an
event, and she and I hit it off right away just as friends. And we met up and her
name was Lola in the book. And we ended up meeting up and she sat
down with me, um, and she said, I have an hour for you. What do you need to know? And right away I was like, I was so
impressed that she just said, like, she was putting guard rails on her time
because I was asking her a favor and I said, I’m writing this book. I’m really looking for somebody who can. Who I can run things by and call BS on or
tell me if I’m on there, I’m on the wrong track on. And she said, I can do that. She’s like, what else do you need? And I was like, well, I don’t know. I said, well, could you recommend some
book sources, some sources for me to read? And she said, I can do that. She’s like, what else? And I said, that’s really it. Can I email you once in a while? She’s like, yes. And then I went to shake her hand. She said, you could hug me. And I said, okay, I got to give her a hug. And she ended up being the most incredible
person to work with, and she became, she’s a true friend, and I just found the way
that she set it up, she was doing me a favor. She was gracious, she was nice. She didn’t follow through with everything
she said, and she was a reader on the book, so I just found her. She would be shocked if I said this, but
that was such a great way to get the book started in a weird way. And then she was the one who
I had the session with her. I scheduled a, um, I want to know what
it’d be like to have a session with a Dom where everything is negotiated beforehand. Because the idea, we know when you’re with
a partner or a new party, just kind of like jump in bed with them
and you’re like, I don’t know. Let’s see. See what happens, you know? But the one ring. Yeah. So I, so she was super fun
and she said, let’s do it. So I, she asked me what I wanted to do. I had never thought about it. And then we followed through with the
session, which I have to say I’ve seen a personal trainer and now I’ve
seen a professional dominatrix. And seeing a personal trainer is way more
horrible and stressful, like way more upsetting, you know? And it was just so interesting
that she, I just felt very safe. And it was really fun. And I got this idea of really what it was
like, and I had to suddenly, I’m like, Oh, I get why people, it’s
not my thing per se. That’s not where my predilection, but
I got it and I really understood, and suddenly the book made
a lot more sense to me. So the fact that she was willing to do
that with me and she, I would have paid her for her time, but I. I think I put in the book, I gave
her like a, I gave her like a pastry. She gave her a BASCA, you
know, it’s a good pop yet. Um, so that was, that was great. That was, she’s very important to me. And she got an extra
shout out in the book for. You know? And just for being such a great friend
and you know, so she is a very important person to me. I love how right. The beginning of the relationship, she not
only talked about the amount of time she had, very direct, but sounded
still gracious, right? Direct, gracious told you exactly what
she could give you, what she couldn’t give you, and a power move. Yeah. She’s like, I was like, Oh, okay, well
I kind of do this and this and this. And immediately I was impressed and
immediately I felt her time was important. Immediately she was put like a little bit
above me and immediately I was impressed, you know? And I was thinking about like how, how,
what is that way of creating a sort of queen Lee atmosphere. But in a gracious way. Uh, some of the Dom’s talk about the
difference to being a goddess and a mistress, which is all very personal. And to me, I think that I don’t want to
ever be cruel, but I would like people to, I wouldn’t mind a little bit of a hushed. Uh, cause I walk into your room, you know,
I do want people to come see me and just value me. And. Speck my time, and you know, and when I’m
nice to them, be like, thanks for being so great. You know? That’s what I want. You know? So I think that I just was very
impressed by how direct and calm. But she did have time constraints. She was moving that night, you know,
and it was winter and it was freezing. So, and we got a lot
accomplished in that hour. That’s the other thing too. We didn’t, we didn’t have
to do small talk or BS. He’s like, what do you need? How can I help you? And the books she recommended were
incredibly interesting and very important. I think that’s a technique though, is
that when you tell somebody with the time constraint is ahead of time, all the BS
goes away and it just is, okay, Hey, I’ve got 20 minutes, we’ve got this stuff
to cover, and bam, bam, bam, bam. Like you talk about meetings, you know,
at about meetings at work and how they can just drag on and on and on and on. And dominatrix is if figured that out,
like you’re not going to have the first half be all this small talk, like we’re
getting the business like, no, that’s what they’re not paying for. Small talk and small talk is boring. And also if someone, so
people reach out to me a lot. Oh, can I have coffee with you? Can I have coffee with you? You know, I’m so nice now I’m trying to
say, be like, if you want to see me come to Queens. And most people are like, forget it. I don’t want to talk to
you that bad, you know? Or I’ll say, I’m. I start to say now, but hi, how are you? Blip? Or what are you up to that I’ll
be like, okay, how can I help you? And I start, I say that earlier on, and
it immediately changed the tenor of the conversation and it becomes
much more professional. And then I do have an out
time and I shake hands. I got to go, let me
know how I can help you. And I try to give them all the help I can. I’ve learned this during that hour. And then after that, like I am pretty
busy, but earlier than don’t, you don’t have to make small talk. You could say, hi, how are you? Thanks for reaching out. What can I do for you? I’m a smiler. I can’t help it. I’m a smiler I so I’m not
going to pretend to not be. I felt that in my financial planning
meetings back in my old job. We were trained initially as
salespeople to do small talk. At the beginning. I never did that. I found if we got into it, you and I would
find commonality and we would have these like we have today. We’ll have these little journeys that are
much more real partway through where like, Oh, there’s a commonality, and then
instead of the BS small talk, it’s much more, much more with it. It exhausting to be honest, like to make
small talk with someone you don’t know. I find very exhausting and boring
parties, especially around the holidays. I get so tired. Yeah. The book is called bowed down lessons from
dominatrixes on how to get everything you want. It’s available everywhere. I have to ask you something else though,
and by the way, we’ll link to the book on our show notes page at Stacie Benjamin’s
dot com but I do want to ask you, since you know, nobody listens to the
show, Lindsey, it’s just you and I. What’s coming up on spent. We got to ask about your podcast. Yes, thank you. So I brought back spent was did great when
I did it in 2016, 2017, I had to put it on hiatus when I went back to work at stash. I had a great job there. I brought back a mini
season about sex and money. I interviewed a porn star. Her name is Stoya. Uh, she talked about, uh, royalties
and residuals and payment processors. She was fantastic. She’s. She’s great. And I spoke to these two Dom’s, I talked
about entrepreneurship and how they started their own business. You talk to, you also talked
to Ellison Schrager about risk. Yes. I spoke to her about risk because she went
out to Nevada to talk to some of the legal brothel owners, the late Dennis Hoff. And uh, so I tried to find little bits of
talking about sex and money and in sort of a different way. And that’s. The way I like to do things. I like to, I’m I want to do mini series
where I talk to different people in different perspectives about a topic. So looking into the future as I wrap
up the book stuff, I’m thinking about different things to do with, to do with
Spence and I want to cover labor stuff. I want to cover medicine. I want to keep it funny. Um, so I always want to have one funny
comedy aspect to something because I. I think that’s great and useful, but I’m,
I’m looking at tackling things per topic and finding different angles and ways in
a, still very interviewees, still very storytelling, more of an approach
to that than an advice perspective. So I’m really excited to do that and to
just grow spreads as a, as a brand, just scary. I know that feeling. I know that feeling. What’s cool is while we’re waiting for
the new season, they’re all evergreen. Everybody. You should go back and listen to these
cause they’re, they are hilarious and fun and informative like this show. You’re not going to get quote nuggets. There’s no magic formula to spend. Hashtag spoilers everything
is very much my philosophy. But everyone’s financial problems are a
little bit different, but I do believe that different people’s
perspectives can help you. And I also think that
you will learn things. I just might not be the things that
you thought you wanted to know. Like I didn’t know that porn
stars don’t get any royalties. I didn’t realize that they
have all this trouble. A Delta performers have a lot of
trouble keeping business accounts. I didn’t know that. They have all this trouble
they have getting paid. There’s all these things that you will
learn about people in their jobs that are very interesting. And then it gets you thinking about other
things like, well, who else has trouble getting paid? Why do they have trouble getting paid? And then you start to dig in deeper and
you start to learn things about how other people make money. And it is an odd, to me, it’s. What you do to make an honest
living is, is up to you. And so I thought it was, I’m so, you’ll
always learn something, might not be what you think you wanted to learn,
but that’s, that’s what I like. It’s always a surprise listening to spend. Lindsey, great talking to you. It’s about time we got this done
and, uh, let’s do this again soon. You bet. I can’t wait. Hey there, money nerds. I’m Joe’s Bob’s neighbor, Doug,
and welcome to my trivia slug. Just in case you don’t remember what I
say today, we’re celebrating dr Seuss’s birthday that took care of, you know,
like green eggs with your mutual funds. Oh gee, my friend. You’ll like it. Oh gee, I am. Here’s a side of something else. Here’s a side, a trivia for
your listening pleasure. While dr Seuss, his books
may have been smash hits. He’s sold over 650 billion copies. Some of his movie appreciation
might’ve given him fits. While some of these movies help
people take their wallet to drop. Here’s the question, which film adaptation
of dr Susan’s books is considered the biggest flop? I’ll have your answer right after this. Marshall, welcome to
friends made easy with me. You host Matilda. Today I’m joined by certified financial
planner, Devin Carroll, and together we will share a bubbler and simple French
phrase so you too can use it in your own life. Sound easy. Today’s phrase is mutual
funds with high fees. Make me uncomfortable. Larry. In France, you would say this
popular phrase just like this. Laurie Lee from the blessed Mavic,
the cousin Vima met malaise. Once again. Laurie Lee from the breast. Mavic, the presell Vima met malaise. Now let’s hear certify financial planner. Devin Carroll. Try triads. Ready, Devin? Okay. Fonz communes. Deplacement Larry Avec honorary. Oliver’s me font. Melis. Nailed it. Perfect. See how we sound almost exactly alike. You two can speak French easily and
comfortably listening to stacking than shamans. See you next time. what a back book. Love and friends. It’s time for the trivia and today we’re
celebrating the birthday of a man who helped. Lots of kids say, yes, you can dr Seuss. Yes, you can win my trivia. You can win it with a gas. You can. When it by saying less, but what
was the answer to the question? You’re going to love it. Yes, you can. What’s the answer, Doug? The man here was the question
which film adaptation of dr Seuss. His books is considered the biggest flop. You could clean up how bad
this movie is with a mop. The answer the cat in the hat. Well, it’s an absolute mess. The film made 25 million or less. It received largely negative reviews
and all its humor was considered rude. Mike Meyers played the cat, but
it wasn’t that great in his hat. The cherry on top of this whole thing, dr
Seuss, his widow, Audrey Geisel thought the project didn’t sing. She was so unimpressed with the movie
version that she refused to allow any further live action. Surgeon. Okay. Is this over yet? My script’s done, so I’ll say, you bet. See ya. Big thanks to Lindsay for
stopping by the basement. Doug Sher stuck around for
a long time, didn’t he? He did. What an interesting way to open up the
eight weeks, but, but like a good boy, he would, you know, face the
corner the entire time. I just say so many, so many straight, so
many straightforward lessons there though. So, so many, Hey, let’s throw out the even
lifeline and tackle some of life’s most important questions. Our friends at Haven life insurance agency
put what you value first, your loved ones and your time, and that’s why they’ve
made buying quality term life insurance. Actually simple head to Stacie forward slash Haven life now for a free quote, and you’ll
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to waste your time with SOG. The application is simple. It’s online. We talked earlier about
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quickly versus a lot of the legacy companies where you have to spend weeks
waiting to get your policy approved. Policy prices are affordable. Their policies are issued by mass
mutual, more than 160 year old insurance. So you know where it’s coming from today. Uh, we just got a letter from Diana. Diana has an estate question, which is
funny because she starts off this being the dominatrix episode. She says as the executive tricks. Then she says, ice forward fellows
of an elderly families estate. What options should I consider for the
portion of the estate being left to two pre teenage brothers? Their father is a child of
the future deceased person. He has a disability related income that
will not allow a new accumulate assets, so his portion of the estate will
be split between his sons. The future dead persons will mention is
leaving the inheritance in a trust to the pre-teens. I don’t have an active relationship
with the shirttail relatives. I don’t want to be a
trustee for these funds. There’s an uncle of the preteens whom
I’m planning to recruit into that role. The estate will not be required to go
through probate in our state, which is Wisconsin. If I don’t have a probate judge dictating
who the trustee will be, how the funds will be invested in it, what age the
preteens will receive the proceeds in the trust. Are all these decisions made at my
discretion or will the trustee determine how the funds are invested and when the
trust will be dispersed and dissolve since the will is moot on these points? Is this question just too weedy and state
specific for you to respond to also, by the way? Well, well, I’ll get to the. I’ll get to the P S later
on, but let’s dive into this. This is some estate planning stuff. Oh, gee. So Diana is not, the trustee wants
somebody else to be the trustee, but as the trust, she said there’s
only a will, but it could be. It could end up being, and I think you
need to look at the specifics, Diana, of your state. I had an attorney here in Michigan that
would do something called a popup trust, meaning that there was
no trust immediately. And by the way, there are
significant downsides to this trust. Number one being the trust is created on
the date of death and the bad news there is then you still have some. Small probate issues, but it’s much better
than the bigger huge probate issues. So possibly, Oh, gee, this
involves a popup trust. Yeah. I have no idea about the estate laws and
in Wisconsin, but it sounds like it’s ultra complicated and a couple of things. Firstly, if you have no desire to be in
charge of this, you have to make that known. Now, it sounds like whoever puts you in
charge is not dead yet, so if you don’t want to be in charge, then you have to
tell the person, don’t put me in charge. Put somebody else in charge. Because it’s not something that’s a very
easy process to get out of once you’re kind of it. You mentioned that there’s no probate,
which I would find hard to believe if there’s a will, will indicates probate. You know, I guess if it’s a small enough. Probate estate, then there’s not any
probate, but then what are we talking about in terms of inheritance
money for two teenage children? One way to avoid all of this is just to
list the kids as a beneficiary on the accounts that you want to have. If the person has a brokerage account and
he wants it to go 50 50 to two kids, just leave him as a beneficiary. The problem is, is that I would never
in a million years leave money to. An underage kid cause you’ll in most cases
end up with a court appointed guardian for the money, which will dictate how that
money is invested and how that money is distributed until the kids turn 18 once
the kids turn 18 if you don’t have any of this pre established, then the kids just
get the money at 18 and I was a pretty irresponsible 18 year old. I would be pretty irresponsible with
any large sum of money because at 18 any amount of money is large sum of money. So I think this is a really good question
for an estate planning attorney in your area, and this is one of those things
where you’ve got to begin with the end in mind. You have to look at this from the
perspective of what do I want to have happen as the decedent,
as the person who’s. Issuing all this money out? Do I want the kids to have the money
when they’re 13 do I want to have one? They’re 25 do I want them to
have risk restrictions around it? They can only use it for college. Is it for a new home purchase when
they’re 40 is it for their grandkids? You know, you can establish all of those
rules while you’re still living and create the trust that needs to be. Created to have it managed appropriately. The do nothing plan,
which is what you have. It gives the kids the money at 18 and
causes a whole heck of a lot of issues between now and 18 so this is one of those
things where, you know, I’ve got a hammer. Everything looks like a nail and you
kind of need to get in a state planning attorneys opinion on this, a qualified
opinion, if it is thesis together, and if it is the pop-up trust work that I
referenced earlier, what I would do, Diana, is request a meeting
with the attorney because. If, if there is, there’s an attorney
involved and I’ll get back to that as well, but, but if so requested, meeting
with the attorney because the attorney can then walk you through all of these
questions because it’ll end up being at the end. It’ll end up being you and
the attorney working on this. And by the way, if the will says a trust
in it and there is no attorney involved, that that junk drives me crazy because
you know what ends up happening. Nobody knows how that stuff works. People go on some. Facebook forum or some website and they
hear, Hey, you can do all this crap yourself. Well maybe you can, but then you pass away
and leave somebody like me in charge and I don’t know anything about it. Guess what I got to do? I got to use your money. To get an attorney to walk me through it
later, and it’s an attorney that I choose instead of somebody who you could have
already done your due diligence on. Like one thing I liked about choosing
an attorney myself was that I know this person can explain everything
to my family about how it works. And for me. That’s a huge thing
for the attorney to do. Not only do they know the law, but they
can walk everybody through why this is important and how it all works. Do it yourself estate planning
at this level, especially. No, not great if there’s no
attorney involved with this. Yeah, I’m with you. Oh gee, there’s gotta be one. Well, and this goes back
to the very beginning. If you don’t have any interest in any
of this and get out of it now tell the person, no, I’m not. I have no interest in this. I can’t help you. I’m just not my expertise. I do not want this responsibility because
the current plan is you’re responsible. You’re like, I don’t want to be the
trustee that I don’t want to be the one in charge of. Distributing this to the teenagers. Guess what? You are that person right now, so get out
of it now if you want to get out of it. Thanks for the question, Diana. By the way, Diana’s P S I should get to,
she says, since you and Paula talk about the Royal so much, I’m wondering if old
get would be a fitting tag for Oh gee, he does sound pretty crabby most of the time. We’re going to start calling you old. Get I like that. I don’t get it. But you don’t follow those? Nope. No, I don’t. Thanks. She says, thank you for that compliment. I dunno. It’s a great grumpy, grumpy. No, no. You’re never grumpy. Never. It doesn’t happen. Thanks to Doug for making
the show worthwhile. Listen, she says, signed the
not dead princess of oils. Diane. That’s awesome. Thanks for that. Diana, you’ve a question for us. Call our voicemail kina free tee shirt. I know and a free tee shirt,
Stacie Benjamin’s dot com forward slash voicemail for that, and you too can
have your question answered by us. All right. That’s going to do it for today. Big thanks to everybody. I’ll let Doug go through all of the many
people we have to thank for today’s show, but thanks to all of you for. Come back for another eight weeks. Man, we got a great, we have an action
packed eight weeks of shows as we help each other roll towards spring. Can’t wait for, it’s already spring here. So easy on that. Uh, we get to celebrate winter. I like celebrating winter. You can have winter, October to April. All right. Last thing here is this. If you need better financial planning
help in your corner, Oh, gee. And his team have the doors open so. Get on their calendar by going to
stacking forward slash O G. all right, that’s gonna do it for today. Doug, take it from here, man. What should we have learned today? What should we have learned today? First, take a lesson from Lindsey. Take control. If you want to see a change in your
life and finances, the first step is to redefine those relationships,
keeping you in place. Second, take a lesson from our headline. If you are making a buck but are still
living paycheck to paycheck, you need to make a budget before you find
yourself retired and broke. But the big lesson, Oh, try
to rhyme the whole show. They don’t pay us all enough dough. No Joe, no rhyme. This show. special thanks to Lindsay Goldberg
for stopping by the basement. Are you looking to take more
control of your finances? You can order Lindsey’s book, bow down
from her site, Lindsey gold or through our show
[email protected] This show is created by Joe saucy hive,
produced by Richie rudder, Reese, and engineered by the amazing
Steve Stewart online. Visit us on Twitter at Benjamin’s
cast, or on our Facebook page. I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor. Doug and I do not like computer jokes. Not one bit as V podcast may receive
payment on the show from sponsors and guests in the form of books. Give away items, discounts,
or other remunerations. That’s a fake word. There’s no way you take
advice from these doors. But like Joe’s mom always says,
don’t take advice from people yet. Don’t know. This show is for entertainment purposes
only, and before making any financial decisions, consult with
a real financial advisor. I just got . A message. I was going to talk about a move. He may be able to do that on on, on
Wednesday, but I just got this awesome message from a listener to the show. Mike. I’m a big fan of board games as a couple
people might know, but I also think that some of the lessons and give,
here’s what I don’t like. I don’t like games that teach you things. I really, when you see educational and
board game together, you should encourage whoever that designer is to please stop. Because I don’t want an educational lesson
when I’m playing in game, but, but I will tell you that I learned a ton
from playing games, not directly. Like as an example, there’s a game called
power grid, and I think you’ve played power grid and in power grid you’re
creating a network of utilities. And it’s interesting
that while it does have. Everything from coal to oil to nuclear
power to wind power and garbage. It doesn’t try to teach you
really anything about those. However, what I, what I will say is this,
and this is what I like about games and the and the power of teaching that games
have is that now every time that I see something about utilities, where
before I was just looking blankly. At the piece and flipping past it in the
newspaper, my Flipboard or wherever it might be. Now I’m like, Oh, more
news about wind power. Oh, what’s going on with coal? Oh, you know, so I’m very, very interested
and it’s because of power grid that I got there. The game suits a shill for
the utilities industry. Is that what you’re saying? I just know that I’m very interested now
in how utilities work and I know how to make cheeseburgers. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Get this. Hasbro is bringing back this game from the
1980s another game that doesn’t teach you anything but subliminally. Well, I’ll let you listen. It’s, it’s mall madness. The talking shop to your drop game. Fail after the fact and boutique my own credit card, no deposits, $100 Oh the mall with all their stuff. I get a credit card. I don’t need any money. I can go crazy at the mall and the first
one who gets everything on the list and maxes out your credit card wins. Some great lessons there. Oh, gee. Are we at the top yet, Maria at the top yet? Oh, this piece comes from end gadget. Basically, we’re just gonna like
teach kids how to shop on Amazon. Ah, ah, Hasbro’s bringing mall madness
back for old fans and everyone else missing local malls. That became a casualty. The retail apocalypse companies given the
electronic shopping theme board game of make-over for 2020 16 years after
the latest version came out. According to bustle, the 2020 version
features a three D game board. And will allow players to
choose a personality in play. As Gwen of Sage and Avery, or a Dax, for,
you’re free to imagine what personalities those characters have, and
we’ll have updated storefronts. It’s core gameplay
remains the same, though. There’s still an electronic unit that
directs players to their next move, tells them where the sales are, and also
make sound effects like shushing. This is like the worst idea ever. Please don’t buy your kid’s mall madness. Leaving so bad. It’s so bad. Thanks for sending that to us. Mike.

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